--- /dev/null
+18:59:39 <OdyX> #startmeeting
+18:59:39 <MeetBot> Meeting started Wed Jul 19 18:59:39 2017 UTC. The chair is OdyX. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
+18:59:39 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
+19:00:05 <hartmans> Sam Hartman
+19:00:07 * marga Margarita Manterola
+19:00:11 <fil> Philip Hands
+19:00:17 <OdyX> marga, fil, hartmans, Mithrandir, bremner, ntyni : ping
+19:00:21 <OdyX> Didier Raboud
+19:00:23 <ntyni> Niko Tyni
+19:00:42 <bremner> err, right. David Bremner
+19:00:49 <Mithrandir> Tollef Fog Heen
+19:01:14 <OdyX> Oh, forgot keithp
+19:01:21 <OdyX> (I'm bad at names, and lists)
+19:01:38 <Mithrandir> (just use pingall. :-) )
+19:01:56 <OdyX> yeah, right :)
+19:02:08 <marga> But there's a lot of extra people
+19:02:20 <bremner> not sure why else anyone would idle here, other than to watch meetings
+19:02:39 <Mithrandir> yes, that.
+19:02:48 <OdyX> #topic Review of previous meetings' TODOs
+19:02:59 <OdyX> I had the chair formal vote: check
+19:03:26 <OdyX> and closing 862051 acknowledging consensus: no check
+19:03:53 <OdyX> marga: closure mail for other contenders ?
+19:04:02 <marga> ... not done
+19:04:05 <marga> Bad Marga
+19:04:23 <Mithrandir> I don't think we can just close 862051, as I wrote in the mail, since it means reverting a previous decision by the ctte.
+19:04:43 <Mithrandir> need to fix up the suggested text with feedback
+19:04:43 <hartmans> Mithrandir: this is nodejs
+19:04:45 <hartmans> ?
+19:04:48 <OdyX> marga: do you intend to do it, and do you have capacity ?
+19:04:54 <OdyX> (Let's close one topic at a time :-) )
+19:04:55 <Mithrandir> hartmans: yes.
+19:05:19 <marga> I should do it, it shouldn't take that long
+19:05:37 <OdyX> #action marga to send closure mails to other contenders (which list stays TC-only)
+19:05:41 <hartmans> Mithrandir: I'm fine if we want to have a formal resolution if you would prefer that. I can make arguments on both sides of the procedural issue
+19:05:42 <OdyX> Good, let's move on
+19:05:52 <OdyX> #topic #865929 Advice on dealing with GRUB upgrade failure caused by init-select
+19:06:02 <OdyX> (We'll come to the nodejs one in a moment)
+19:06:21 <OdyX> This was opened by cjwatson, right?
+19:06:28 <Mithrandir> yes
+19:06:28 <fil> yup
+19:06:44 <OdyX> It seemed we had consensus, but at least I failed to communicate that I was in agreement with the crowd.
+19:07:13 <fil> the consensus seems sane to me too (having just read it)
+19:07:14 <ntyni> ack on apparent consensus
+19:07:34 <OdyX> My line of thinking was that removed packages lose the right to claim configuration files, and if other packages have to do some cleanup after that, it's a policy violation that makes a lot of practical sense.
+19:07:50 <OdyX> And I don't think we should be generic about that, but this particular case seemed quite clear.
+19:08:44 * fil agrees, and no need to wait for policy to get round to reflecting that, as new policy is being developed by the act of fixing this
+19:08:56 <hartmans> makes sense
+19:08:57 <OdyX> Who could champion a resolution around these lines ?
+19:09:19 <OdyX> (not mine precisely, the bug consensus)
+19:09:26 <ntyni> fwiw I don't think it's even a policy violation in the first place
+19:09:40 <ntyni> it's adopting an orphaned configuration file
+19:09:45 <OdyX> I'm underwaters @work, so I can't commit to anything currently :-/
+19:10:14 <ntyni> I guess I could take a shot though I have no experience drafting resolutions so far :)
+19:10:19 <marga> Same here
+19:10:36 <bremner> by resolution we just mean the requested advice, right?
+19:10:39 <ntyni> yes
+19:10:47 <OdyX> Well yes. A somewhat formal text.
+19:11:02 <fil> I'd need to read it all properly again, but can probably come up with something after that
+19:11:24 <hartmans> ntyni: If you draft a first cut and want to drop me mail at hartmans@debian.org (copying the list if you like) I'd be happy to review
+19:11:38 <hartmans> I don't currently have cycles to put together the advice but would be happy to do my best at resolutionification
+19:11:50 <ntyni> thanks, works for me (unless fil wants to do it? :)
+19:11:55 <OdyX> fil & ntyni care to collaborate on that one?
+19:12:01 <ntyni> sure, fine by me
+19:12:09 <fil> me too
+19:12:14 <hartmans> my rationale is to get more people familiar writing resolutions which is why I suggested working with you.
+19:12:24 <ntyni> cool, I'll get back to you both then :)
+19:12:33 <hartmans> O, no, fil is totally qualified
+19:12:40 <OdyX> #action fil & ntyni to draft a resolution for #865929
+19:12:41 <hartmans> I'll stand aside and let things move faster
+19:12:54 <ntyni> okay
+19:13:08 <OdyX> I don't want anyone feel excluded, but I'm all for efficiency.
+19:13:16 <OdyX> Anything else to add to that one?
+19:13:39 <OdyX> #topic #862051 Rename nodejs back to node for buster, now that ax25-node has been removed?
+19:13:48 <fil> hartmans: thank you for your confidence (however misplaced ;-) )
+19:13:49 <OdyX> There we have it: node vs nodejs :)
+19:14:26 <bremner> so we have consensus+bikeshedding on wording?
+19:14:51 <bremner> (says the first bikeshedder)
+19:15:19 <OdyX> Ian's resolution is going too much into details, but generally fine
+19:15:24 <Mithrandir> I asked for wordsmithing and feedback, so I don't really think bikeshedding is the right term.
+19:15:32 <bremner> ack
+19:15:32 <OdyX> I don't like the "4. indefinitely"
+19:16:01 <OdyX> Well, actually, re-reading it, it seems fine if you remove 4.
+19:16:10 <bremner> 4 seems anyway redundant?
+19:16:11 <Mithrandir> I'm slightly leaning towards just saying 1. resolution repealed and in the surrounding text noting that this means nodejs is free to do whatever they want (within the normal boundaries of policy)
+19:16:30 <hartmans> Mithrandir: I support that
+19:16:31 * fil thinks the only thing we actually need to resolve is 1. ... what he said
+19:16:36 <bremner> that also occured to me
+19:16:40 <OdyX> Mithrandir: I'm doing misjustice to your proposal; I was just reading the buglog from the bottom.
+19:17:03 <OdyX> I'm fine with that.
+19:17:18 <OdyX> "that" being your proposal being "just 1."
+19:17:39 <Mithrandir> ok, seems like we're in agreement. I'll do another round with a proposal and assuming nobody has major complaints take it to a vote.
+19:17:43 <Mithrandir> so we can get this closed out.
+19:17:50 <bremner> sounds good to me
+19:18:05 <ntyni> works for me too
+19:18:11 <ntyni> & thanks :)
+19:18:12 <OdyX> #action Mithrandir to do another round with a proposal and assuming no major complaints, take #862051 to a vote.
+19:18:17 <marga> I agree, will the rationale include that it's repealed due to it being obsolete?
+19:18:51 <Mithrandir> marga: it already does, see the first sentence.
+19:19:05 <Mithrandir> or first paragraph, really.
+19:19:29 <marga> Ok, yeah, sorry. I was just mentioning the proposed shortening
+19:19:44 <marga> Anyway, fine with me
+19:19:44 <Mithrandir> right, I'll keep the intro
+19:19:45 <OdyX> #info https://bugs.debian.org/862051#63 is Mithrandir's original proposal.
+19:20:02 <OdyX> Good, we keep things moving.
+19:20:05 <OdyX> #topic #839172 TC decision regarding #741573 menu policy not reflected yet
+19:20:21 <OdyX> It's on the agenda as it's an open bug. Nothing moved in that area.
+19:20:43 <OdyX> But I'm happy to see the Debian Policy Team back alive.
+19:20:43 <marga> We will work on it during DebConf?
+19:20:47 <OdyX> We will.
+19:20:52 <marga> K
+19:21:12 <bremner> at least one policy editor will be there
+19:21:16 <OdyX> #info Work will get moving in that area at DebConf17.
+19:21:23 <OdyX> #topic Additional Business
+19:22:04 <OdyX> #info The DebConf TC BoF is scheduled
+19:22:16 <Mithrandir> yay, when?
+19:22:24 <marga> Nothing from me. See most of you on monthly
+19:22:31 <marga> Montreal :)
+19:22:42 <OdyX> https://debconf17.debconf.org/talks/203/
+19:22:49 <OdyX> Aug 07, 17:00 local time
+19:23:08 <hartmans> Despite my being a flake I did manage to register for debconf thanks to help from the debconf team
+19:23:10 <OdyX> #action OdyX to add all present TC members as co-speakers
+19:23:23 <fil> hartmans: great :-)
+19:23:26 <OdyX> (I was in a hurry as my initial submission apparently disappeared)
+19:23:28 <OdyX> hartmans: cool
+19:23:49 <hartmans> I will be in Keith and bdale's hotel
+19:23:57 <keithp> hartmans: cool
+19:24:05 <OdyX> ohai :)
+19:24:16 <keithp> yeah, oops; trying to get out of the house and spaced the meeting
+19:24:21 <Mithrandir> no additional business from me. Looking forward to seeing folks in Montreal.
+19:24:25 <ntyni> some kind of remote participation would be nice for the BoF, I guess a video stream + irc would do
+19:24:39 <OdyX> Oh you ain't there :-(
+19:24:46 <ntyni> yeah :(
+19:24:46 <bremner> we may have to grovel to videoteam
+19:25:17 <bremner> oh, wait, if it's scheduled that should be ok with video
+19:25:19 <bremner> nvm me
+19:25:20 <OdyX> #action All DC17-present TC members to keep remote TC members in mind before and during the BoF.
+19:25:45 <ntyni> thanks
+19:25:57 <OdyX> Great.
+19:26:07 <ntyni> and have a good time in Montreal
+19:26:24 <OdyX> It's been productive and quick; hopefully still somewhat human.
+19:26:34 <OdyX> Looking forward to see (most of) you there in some weeks!
+19:27:04 <OdyX> #endmeeting
\ No newline at end of file
--- /dev/null
+====================
+#debian-ctte Meeting
+====================
+
+
+Meeting started by OdyX at 18:59:39 UTC. The full logs are available at
+http://meetbot.debian.net/debian-ctte/2017/debian-ctte.2017-07-19-18.59.log.html
+.
+
+
+
+Meeting summary
+---------------
+* Review of previous meetings' TODOs (OdyX, 19:02:48)
+ * ACTION: marga to send closure mails to other contenders (which list
+ stays TC-only) (OdyX, 19:05:37)
+
+* #865929 Advice on dealing with GRUB upgrade failure caused by
+ init-select (OdyX, 19:05:52)
+ * ACTION: fil & ntyni to draft a resolution for #865929 (OdyX,
+ 19:12:40)
+
+* #862051 Rename nodejs back to node for buster, now that ax25-node has
+ been removed? (OdyX, 19:13:39)
+ * ACTION: Mithrandir to do another round with a proposal and assuming
+ no major complaints, take #862051 to a vote. (OdyX, 19:18:12)
+ * https://bugs.debian.org/862051#63 is Mithrandir's original proposal.
+ (OdyX, 19:19:45)
+
+* #839172 TC decision regarding #741573 menu policy not reflected yet
+ (OdyX, 19:20:05)
+ * Work will get moving in that area at DebConf17. (OdyX, 19:21:16)
+
+* Additional Business (OdyX, 19:21:23)
+ * The DebConf TC BoF is scheduled (OdyX, 19:22:04)
+ * LINK: https://debconf17.debconf.org/talks/203/ (OdyX, 19:22:42)
+ * ACTION: OdyX to add all present TC members as co-speakers (OdyX,
+ 19:23:10)
+ * ACTION: All DC17-present TC members to keep remote TC members in
+ mind before and during the BoF. (OdyX, 19:25:20)
+
+Meeting ended at 19:27:04 UTC.
+
+
+
+
+Action Items
+------------
+* marga to send closure mails to other contenders (which list stays
+ TC-only)
+* fil & ntyni to draft a resolution for #865929
+* Mithrandir to do another round with a proposal and assuming no major
+ complaints, take #862051 to a vote.
+* OdyX to add all present TC members as co-speakers
+* All DC17-present TC members to keep remote TC members in mind before
+ and during the BoF.
+
+
+
+
+Action Items, by person
+-----------------------
+* fil
+ * fil & ntyni to draft a resolution for #865929
+* marga
+ * marga to send closure mails to other contenders (which list stays
+ TC-only)
+* Mithrandir
+ * Mithrandir to do another round with a proposal and assuming no major
+ complaints, take #862051 to a vote.
+* ntyni
+ * fil & ntyni to draft a resolution for #865929
+* OdyX
+ * OdyX to add all present TC members as co-speakers
+* **UNASSIGNED**
+ * All DC17-present TC members to keep remote TC members in mind before
+ and during the BoF.
+
+
+
+
+People Present (lines said)
+---------------------------
+* OdyX (58)
+* Mithrandir (16)
+* ntyni (16)
+* bremner (13)
+* hartmans (13)
+* marga (13)
+* fil (9)
+* MeetBot (2)
+* keithp (2)
+
+
+
+
+Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4
+
+.. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot
projects / debian-ctte.git / commitdiff