From: Didier Raboud Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2018 19:35:33 +0000 (+0100) Subject: Get 20180321 meeting X-Git-Url: https://git.donarmstrong.com/?p=debian-ctte.git;a=commitdiff_plain;h=bd5464f2af55412120623267975e08397b854dd2 Get 20180321 meeting --- diff --git a/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.log.txt b/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.log.txt new file mode 100644 index 0000000..0d1b52f --- /dev/null +++ b/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.log.txt @@ -0,0 +1,167 @@ +18:58:57 #startmeeting +18:58:57 Meeting started Wed Mar 21 18:58:57 2018 UTC. The chair is OdyX. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. +18:58:57 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. +18:58:57 * gwolf runs for coffee +18:59:00 #topic round of names. +18:59:06 oh - No, no running for coffee +18:59:06 * marga Margarita Manterola +18:59:12 * gwolf Gunnar Wolf +18:59:13 Niko Tyni +18:59:17 Philip Hands +18:59:19 Simon McVittie +18:59:22 Didier Raboud +18:59:45 Tollef Fog Heen +19:00:19 bremner are you around ? +19:00:37 #topic Review of previous meetings' TODOs +19:01:01 I think they were all done, thanks for that! +19:01:07 re : http://meetbot.debian.net/debian-ctte/2018/debian-ctte.2018-02-21-19.01.html +19:01:18 #topic #877024 modemmanager should ask before messing with serial ports +19:01:30 fil: what's your take here? +19:01:52 it's fixed a couple of weeks ago: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=683839#101 +19:02:05 (I only noticed this evening) +19:02:30 so I guess we can close our bug \o/ +19:02:34 Yay! +19:02:38 Oh, great. +19:02:53 \o/ +19:03:10 FTR, I'm happy with how the process went; not ruling and getting (or having) upstream involved towards a satisfactory solution: great. +19:03:34 yeah, me too -- I am happy to do the closing BTW +19:03:41 #action fil to close #877024 pointing to the #683839 bug closure. +19:04:34 If there are meta things to discuss, let's do the chat in Additional Business +19:04:39 #topic #893200 TC Chair election +19:05:16 As we have a full TC already in 2018, it might make sense to start the rotation already. +19:05:26 start the rotation? +19:05:56 marga: that's when you take over the chair ;-) +19:05:57 as my term expires at the end of this year, we're not likely to change the TC chair before I'm no longer on the TC. +19:05:58 marga: I suggested last meeting that OdyX does not stay as Chair until the Process™ kicks him out +19:06:00 * fil hides +19:06:18 * gwolf is still too young as CTTE-member +19:06:33 so it was suggested that someone else™ would become chair and that I would (of course) stay as helper. +19:06:52 Ok +19:06:59 So, yeah, I have no problem being chair +19:07:15 But I think Didier does a great job :) +19:07:26 And that's the closest we have to a volunteer to the position ☺ +19:07:31 Despite earlier intentions, not much is scripted, so the chair job is mostly trying to avoid copy-paste mistakes from previous mails, and chairing the meetings "firmly". +19:08:01 thanks for volunteering marga :) +19:08:21 and it has this awesome little reward that it's the third-in-line in the power command in Debian :-) +19:08:28 (and agreed that Didier is doing great too) +19:08:35 "reward" +19:08:52 That's the part that's kind of strange +19:09:06 Creating the agenda for the meeting and running the meeting is one thing +19:09:13 Being third-in-line is a different thing +19:09:28 ☺ You can just not think about it +19:09:28 I find it strange that we conflate the two +19:09:30 Oh sure. It's more of a bragging-occasion detail when explaining what the TC chair is doing: "together with the Secretary, fill in a vacant DPL's seat". +19:10:20 AFAIK, we've never needed that power +19:10:33 we can separate the two "de facto" without changing the constitution. It's good™ though for the TC to know who's damned^Win charge of doing the agenda/meeting invites/chairing. +19:11:08 there's also the power of the casting vote +19:11:14 Ah, yes +19:11:19 And that one has been used... +19:11:22 ah true, it can come systemd-handy +19:11:33 Right, IMO it's casting > chair-meetings > fill-in-vacant +19:11:49 fill-in-vacant is a constitutional attribution that has *never* been used +19:11:53 TTBOMK at least +19:11:57 `chair-meetings` can be done without explicit power. It just needs doing. +19:12:03 I think I remember hearing that it was used once +19:12:04 Casting is more important than... yes, what OdyX said +19:12:11 Branden Robinson's term? +19:12:34 Anyway, I feel like I'm de-railing the conversation, but this is something that has bothered me a little bit since I started +19:12:37 so, who would be willing to do the chairing, in addition to OdyX? +19:12:56 I'm willing to do the agenda / chairing meetings stuff +19:12:57 (everybody's on the ballot, but electing somebody who's unhappy being the chair's not the best idea) +19:12:58 I suspect it's much more of a burden on the chair's shoulders when that power needs to be held, than an opportunity, really. +19:13:05 marga: the meeting does not have too many points to cover, so I'm happy to discuss if needed +19:13:10 I'm less sure about the casting vote / replacing the DPL stuff +19:13:29 marga: it's a package, but those other bits are rarely used, so. +19:13:35 We *need* to have a chair (per constitution) +19:13:39 Yes, yes +19:13:46 the ballot doesn't have FD on purpose :-) +19:14:06 Even the casting is not much needed - but I feel it as more important... +19:14:16 OdyX: We could agree to vote in a round so that we hve an eight-way tie. +19:14:23 (but *now* I'm derailing the discussion) +19:14:26 hih +19:14:31 But then the other thing is that it feels weird to be voting for the person that I want to have the casting vote and stack ranking my fellow TC members +19:14:37 marga: I'd be honoured to hand the charge over to you. And as "soon-to-leave" TC member, it also makes sense that I don't get to keep the casting vote token much longer either. +19:14:48 my term expires this year, so while I'd be willing to hold the chair, it's not any better than having OdyX +19:15:36 we can all vote for bremner +19:15:39 marga: *shrug*; that's how elections work. +19:15:53 :-) +19:16:01 As we agreed to have a public vote anyway, it feels to me we gathered enough data to establish our individual votes, don't we ? +19:16:19 oh, sure. +19:16:22 * gwolf nods +19:16:36 As I mentionned in a previous meeting already: please vote sincerely, and (inversely) please don't try to read too much between the lines of the individual votes. +19:16:42 (I'd still prefer to have an enthusiastic candidate - but we can talk off-meeting) +19:16:47 as long as voting for marga doesn't make her unhappy... +19:16:50 err. wut? +19:16:55 sorry I'm late +19:16:58 * Mithrandir dials gwolf's enthusiasm to 11. +19:17:04 Wait, let's do this +19:17:10 I agree to do the meeting thing +19:17:12 * gwolf sets modulo to 10 +19:17:17 Please vote for the other thing +19:17:41 marga: okay; please #action yourself for that :-) +19:17:53 i.e. regardless of the meeting part. Vote for the person that you want to have the casting vote / replacing the DPL power +19:18:16 #action everyone to vote for the TC chair in #892300 before Sat 24 09:25 UTC. +19:18:16 #action Marga will take the secretarial duties (meeting agenda, meeting emails, chairing meetings, etc). Regardless of the outcome of the vote. +19:18:38 #topic Welcome smcv +19:18:48 welcome smcv! +19:18:50 * smcv feels appropriately welcomed +19:18:58 Wilkommen! +19:19:01 That topic wasn't on the agenda, but I'm abusing of my meeting chair powers to sneak it in! +19:19:08 Welcome smcv! +19:19:16 OdyX: That's a great use of your Powers ☺ +19:19:28 Despite the low number of nominations (which we agreed to make public), I'm thrilled to have you on board smcv. +19:19:40 Welcome! +19:19:40 smcv: Welcome :-) +19:19:57 I feel we found a great match for the position with you. And I'm honored to share expiration date with you ☺ +19:20:03 #topic Further rounds of nominations +19:20:28 It's not an emergency just yet, but Mithrandir and myself will leave the TC on Dec 31. +19:20:48 there's been a deadly silence from the last batch of randomness ... I'll give that another kick I guess +19:20:54 fil: You have been handling this dance so far, but I believe it takes quite a bit of effort +19:20:59 Do you want to share the load? +19:21:13 almost none actually -- I have a script I run on master +19:21:17 (we do require coordination, so that we don't pester the same people) +19:21:21 The TC doesn't _need_ to fill the two then-vacant seats then, but now that it's a rolling thing (all of us have started our terms under the new constitution), it needs doing. +19:21:22 fil, does it make sense to give it another kick right now? +19:21:29 ok, that's good +19:22:07 gwolf: and I have a blacklist that grows, so nobody gets bothered twice +19:22:23 I mean if we get nominations now, they would only start their terms in ~9 months... +19:22:36 Debian (as a whole) also needs to address the lack of nominations; perhaps a discussion to be started at DebConf or in the second half of the year, online. +19:22:38 I would rather wait until September/October to start the thing again. +19:22:44 should the blacklisting also expire..? +19:23:03 agreed it feels a bit early +19:23:11 yeah, I think it might make sense to start a broader discussion later in the year. +19:23:13 OdyX: FWIW I found the "Meet the TC" session at DebConf as most convincing push for getting on board +19:23:19 I don't see why it should (especially since I declared that it wouldn't in the spam) +19:23:24 I think we can delay until then at least +19:23:30 OK +19:23:49 FYI: I'm almost certainly not going to be at DC18. +19:23:51 #topic Additional Business +19:24:03 I won't make it to DebConf18 either +19:24:13 sure, I was thinking we had a slot to fill soon for some reason, no point bothering people now +19:24:20 not me either, keeping up my record of 1 debconf per decade +19:24:36 smcv: cool we could meet in DebConf17 then :) +19:24:42 I ought to be there (hopefully with the family :-) ) +19:24:43 I will be there. Got my tickets and all. +19:25:01 My family will be close to 20,000Km away ☺ +19:25:06 not quite sure if I can make DebConf but probably not +19:25:52 Anyway - I think we can decide to leave further nominations until ~ DebConf +19:25:59 Works for me +19:26:03 me too +19:26:04 and we will later see if we have a TC session at DebConf +19:26:16 I'd like to if it's enough of us... +19:26:20 (Not really my problem anymore either :->) +19:26:34 OdyX: you mentioned a possibility of having meta things to discuss around #877024? +19:26:46 There's the "traditional" "meet the TC BoF" that is great to keep +19:26:49 * gwolf nominates OdyX for 2020 :-P +19:27:17 that's mean +19:27:50 smcv: ah yes, right. Context is that we frequently discussed how to initially address incoming issues, and how quickly/firmly we want to reach a "formal TC decision". +19:28:35 looking at that bug from the outside, I must admit my thought was "why is this with the ctte?" +19:28:45 my understanding is that the current TC is (IMHO rightfully) reluctant to rule unless all other venues for consensus have been tried and failed. +19:29:31 I seem to remember that Mithrandir wanted (or was pushed) to write down a "how the TC intends to address incoming issues" sort-of checklist. +19:30:26 having gone ahead and done it recently, I think that if anyone thinks a bug is pointless/misdirected they should just go ahead and close them -- after all it's not a problem to reopen them is the consensus turns out not to exist +19:30:27 Then fil noted that https://www.debian.org/devel/tech-ctte was aplenty, and mostly just needed to be used by TC members and my submitters as checklist. +19:30:42 s/is/if/ +19:31:47 I also think a "You've not done any of steps 1..3 -- try again" closure would be fine too +19:31:58 I concur. +19:32:56 If there's not more coming :-) +19:32:59 #endmeeting \ No newline at end of file diff --git a/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.txt b/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.txt new file mode 100644 index 0000000..fcf9b1c --- /dev/null +++ b/meetings/20180321/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.txt @@ -0,0 +1,84 @@ +==================== +#debian-ctte Meeting +==================== + + +Meeting started by OdyX at 18:58:57 UTC. The full logs are available at +http://meetbot.debian.net/debian-ctte/2018/debian-ctte.2018-03-21-18.58.log.html +. + + + +Meeting summary +--------------- +* round of names. (OdyX, 18:59:00) + +* Review of previous meetings' TODOs (OdyX, 19:00:37) + +* #877024 modemmanager should ask before messing with serial ports + (OdyX, 19:01:18) + * ACTION: fil to close #877024 pointing to the #683839 bug closure. + (OdyX, 19:03:41) + +* #893200 TC Chair election (OdyX, 19:04:39) + * ACTION: everyone to vote for the TC chair in #892300 before Sat 24 + 09:25 UTC. (OdyX, 19:18:16) + * ACTION: Marga will take the secretarial duties (meeting agenda, + meeting emails, chairing meetings, etc). Regardless of the outcome + of the vote. (marga, 19:18:16) + +* Welcome smcv (OdyX, 19:18:38) + +* Further rounds of nominations (OdyX, 19:20:03) + +* Additional Business (OdyX, 19:23:51) + +Meeting ended at 19:32:59 UTC. + + + + +Action Items +------------ +* fil to close #877024 pointing to the #683839 bug closure. +* everyone to vote for the TC chair in #892300 before Sat 24 09:25 UTC. +* Marga will take the secretarial duties (meeting agenda, meeting + emails, chairing meetings, etc). Regardless of the outcome of the + vote. + + + + +Action Items, by person +----------------------- +* fil + * fil to close #877024 pointing to the #683839 bug closure. +* **UNASSIGNED** + * everyone to vote for the TC chair in #892300 before Sat 24 09:25 + UTC. + * Marga will take the secretarial duties (meeting agenda, meeting + emails, chairing meetings, etc). Regardless of the outcome of the + vote. + + + + +People Present (lines said) +--------------------------- +* OdyX (51) +* gwolf (37) +* marga (30) +* fil (19) +* Mithrandir (10) +* ntyni (9) +* smcv (6) +* MeetBot (2) +* bremner (2) +* dondelelcaro (1) + + + + +Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 + +.. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot